Comments on: Wine fraud bilks British investors [BBC]

By: Vinotology » February 11th – The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly

Vinotology » February 11th – The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly — Wed, 23 Feb 2011 02:40:40 +0000

[...] Vino posted this week that wine investment fraud may run as high as £30 million a year, not that I know how much that is exactly in American money, [...]

By: Kathy

Kathy — Mon, 14 Feb 2011 20:40:08 +0000

The charitable wine donation is an issue the US charities are very well aware of – as I noted after interviewing several in a major fraud story I did for Wine Enthusiast a few years ago.

Wine fraud also cycles through the world of doctors on a regular basis, both Jim Budd and I have come across them.

Jim Budd has been writing about scams for many years and is one of the best (if not the best) at tracking and (importantly) reading the legal files. A guy on wein.de tracks auction scams/frauds and sometimes works with ebay.de (scams are uniquely US).

Two reasons where there are few stories of this type:
1. Wine experts are not investigative reporters
2. Writing about fraud and naming names means having a serious legal team willing to watch your back.

From my experience, there are few bloggers who fit that profile.

By: bill marsano

bill marsano — Wed, 09 Feb 2011 18:01:34 +0000

I haven’t heard anything about wine donations, but the write-off opportunity is easily exploited on any number of occasions. In the late 1960s, a footwear mfr donated product to Chilean earthquake relief, taking a write-off for several hundred pairs of high-heel shoes. As gov. of Arkansas, Bill Clinton took a write-off of $3 a paid for his used skivvies.

By: Jarrod H.

Jarrod H. — Wed, 09 Feb 2011 17:47:15 +0000

Dr. Vee, my only ‘evidence’ is personal experience. I’ve personally heard conversations between serious collectors (some of whom might be considered speculators…) regarding the disappointing/over the hill/poorly stored wines that they were planning on donating ‘for the write-off’. The insinuation was that they had themselves been taken advantage of (or had simply made a mistake) when buying a prestigious wine, and instead of making a stink or just ditching the crap in an alley, they would instead stay mum and take the write-off.

I guess what I was after was an opinion from someone more familiar with the industry at large. Am I the only person who has heard of this type of thing? I haven’t heard it mentioned in any of the various article/posts/tv specials about wine fraud, and to me it seems like an interesting slant on the topic.

By: bill marsano

bill marsano — Wed, 09 Feb 2011 14:52:35 +0000

Dr V: all the more embarrassing, then, for the BBC, no? Gigantic TV organization with gigantic publicly funded budget and huge audience ‘uncovers’ a story several years after a tiny little print mag read by, comparatively speaking, hardly anybody. I’d expect better from such a co0lossus, but then I once expected better from the NYTimes.

By: Dr. Vino

Dr. Vino — Wed, 09 Feb 2011 13:36:42 +0000

Jarrod — do you have any evidence of that?

Bill M — I’d venture to say that the viewership of BBC 1 is larger than the readership of Decanter. Also, there may have been more to the piece than this two minute clip.

By: Terroirist » Blog Archive » News Roundup: Cool Climate Syrahs

Terroirist » Blog Archive » News Roundup: Cool Climate Syrahs — Wed, 09 Feb 2011 13:06:00 +0000

[...] The BBC’s “Inside Out” investigation team looks at the current boom in wine investment — and how it’s opening the door for “unscrupulous fraudsters.” (H/T Dr. Vino) [...]

By: bill marsano

bill marsano — Wed, 09 Feb 2011 03:16:11 +0000

Tom, I agree, but only up to a point. Yes, a real relationship with a trustworthy professional is a wonderful thing and a joy gorever, but a lot of grief would be avoided if people would focus on the idea of wine as a pleasure instead of something to make money off. Of course, if investing is your thing, then by all means go ahead, but please don’t expect the rest of the world to care if you lose your shirt.

By: Jarrod H.

Jarrod H. — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 22:43:00 +0000

True enough Bill, that type of donation is absolutely not limited to speculators.

By: Tom Powers

Tom Powers — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 20:22:26 +0000

This simply reenforces the notion that any wine buyer should build an ongoing relationship with reputable professionals. Many times buyers are looking to find the best deal, which they believe to be the lowest price. However, there are more important considerations to be made like provenance and reputation. There are very bad merchants in this industry like any. Fortunately, there are also very good, highly reputable sources of fine wine. One can gamble with the lowest price entities, but that activity will always favor the dealer, just like Vegas.

By: bill marsano

bill marsano — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 20:03:57 +0000

Way to go, Jarrod–you’ve hit on what the Beeb shopuld have been investigating, instead of the tired approach they did take. And must such dumping necessarily be limited to speculators?

By: Jarrod H.

Jarrod H. — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 19:53:21 +0000

Any opinion on the amount of questionable wine that is donated to be auctioned for charitable causes? Seems to me that many wine speculators simply dump questionable bottles for the tax write off… Caveat emptor indeed!

By: bill marsano

bill marsano — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 18:37:22 +0000

The BBC is awfully slow off the mark on this; I’ve been reading about wine-investment scams of this and other kinds for the better part of a decade in Decanter and other publications.

By: Cabfrancophile

Cabfrancophile — Tue, 08 Feb 2011 17:29:14 +0000

Hard to pity bubble speculators. Trading commodities is one thing, as this greases the wheels of the market so to speak. But these people are simply looking to take a cut of profit while the bubble is on the upswing. Just another variant of hedge fund betting. If you don’t want to work for your money, then losing is one possible result.

By: Tweets that mention Wine fraud bilks British investors [BBC] | Dr Vino's wine blog -- Topsy.com

Tue, 08 Feb 2011 17:16:58 +0000

[...] This post was mentioned on Twitter by Wine Lover +, Dr Vino and SlateWine, Ali. Ali said: RT @TopWineNews Wine fraud bilks British investors [BBC]: Wine investment fraud may run £30 million a year http://bit.ly/gxieQt [...]